Garmin: You don’t know what you are talking about, you are just a consumer! Jim: For the third time in 3 years I find out I was right. Garmin: no, we are not wrong therefore you are not right.

Garmin updates are messing up their products. When that happens, their tech support says it is your fault or if out of warranty, broke. No specific instance of buy another one, but what else can you do?

Below is the latest email message trail with Garmin Tech Support. The problem started when my Garmin Edge 1000 could not be found by my computer. Information was downloading by Wi-Fi but I could not get my Garmin to work.

In the process of working on my Edge 1000 to get it to work again, I did two factory resets. I did a boot block. Each time you have to sit down with your Garmin and re-enter all the information and hook up all your sensors, etc. I have four different bikes I use my Garmin with.

I took my Edge 1000 to 2018 Summer @OutdoorRetailer and had the people at the Garmin booth try and get my Edge 1000 to work. No luck.

As you can see from the last email, Garmin Tech Support determined that the pins on my Edge 1000 were busted and my Garmin was sort of dead.

I went for a ride 2 days ago and to recharge the battery hooked it up to my computer again. While looking for a file on my computer I noticed my Garmin Edge 1000 was there, another drive.

I clicked on Garmin Express, the software that links to your Garmin product so you can sync, upload or download info. My Edge 1000 was there and it synched.

Here is the email conversation with Garmin

Hi Jim,

The port on the back of the Edge should have four pins, two for power and two for data. Most likely the data pins are damaged. If you have any other questions or require further support please do not hesitate to let us know or visit our support center (

US: 1.888.442.7646 Canada: 1-866-429-9296 Monday through Friday, 7AM to 7PM. Central Standard Time. Closed Holidays.

Thank you for choosing Garmin,

>> Sent: 24/07/2018 08:12

I appreciate the offer but my edge is way too old and has been replaced once already.

What I find confusing is it can be charged. It just can’t be found? That is a connection issue?

Slow to respond because I’m at the outdoor retailer tradeshow. I’ll see the Garmin sales team today.

More later.



From: <>

Hello Jim,

>> I am sorry about the issues you are having today. I would be happy to work with you towards a resolution today. It seems like the port on the back of the device is damaged. Does the port on the back of the device look damaged or corroded? We suggest cleaning it out with something like canned air if you haven’t yet. If this doesn’t resolve your issue your device may need to be exchanged.

•    What is the serial number for your Edge? It is located on the back, underneath the weather cap.

•    How long have you had the device?

o    For more information about our warranty policies, please visit:

Once we have the above information we will be able to provide further support. If you have any other questions or require further support please do not hesitate to let us know or visit our support center (

>> US: 1.888.442.7646 Canada: 1-866-429-9296 Monday through Friday, 7AM to 7PM. Central Standard Time. Closed Holidays.

Thank you for choosing Garmin,

>> Original Message …

>> >> From:

>> >> To:

Three computers do not recognize my edge 1000. All have Garmin Express. All know I have an Edge 1000 and ate least one other product. None of them can find my edge 1000. I have tried different USB cables, I have tried using USB hubs and plugging directly into a computer USB port. I have rebooted the computer. the Edge 1000 was just factor reset also and it is still not recognized. It is currently plugged into the original computer I have used for the past 3 years to recognize it and it is “searching.” I let it search for 24 hours. Unplug, go for a ride and plug back in.

I also cannot set up the WIFI in the Edge 1000 because of this.

Jim Moss

On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 11:31 PM, James H. (Jim) Moss <> wrote:

Did a full factory reset and it still is not being found.

Tried my third cable. Still not being found.

Restarted my computer, still not found.

By the way, I rarely use Garmin for anything Map my Rides and Ride with GPS and they still cannot find the Edge 1000 or my Fenix 2. Nor is windows explorer finding them.

I’m also getting error messages that the communicator plug in is not working.

I have tried switching to different USB ports, 3.0 and 2.0 working from hubs or directly to the computer and still nothing. I just started getting Unknown USB Device messages when I just switched USB ports again.

Garmin Connect did find my Garmin Memory card just now. Memory Card (f:\) however Windows Explorer is not showing an F drive.

Both the Fenix 2 and the Edge 1000 are charging. The Edge 1000 keeps searching for satellites no matter what I do. Garmin Express can’t find anything


From: []

Dear Jim Moss,

Thank you for contacting Garmin International.

I am sorry to hear that you are still having issues with your Edge 1000. I would be happy to assist you with this.

Have you tried restarting your computer? If that does not work we may need to master reset the device,

There are a few instances in which it may be necessary to perform a master reset on the Edge. A master reset should be performed if the device is:

•    Not functioning properly

•    Needing to be restored to factory default settings

•    Not receiving a satellite signal

•    To bring up the language selection prompt if incorrect language text is displayed

•    Unable to pair accessories2, such as a heart rate monitor or speed/cadence sensor

All settings, workouts and satellite data may be erased when resetting the GPS. Workouts can be backed up in Garmin Connect. If you wish to keep your personalized settings, you will need to backup your device.

To perform a master reset:

1.    Power device off

2.    Press and hold Lap and Start/Stop

3.    Power device on while still holding both buttons

4.    Continue holding buttons when the Garmin “splash” screen appears

5.    Release buttons when Garmin “splash” screen disappears

The reset is successful if, once powered up, the device proceeds into the initial setup wizard. Once the reset and setup wizard are complete, place the device outside with a clear view of the sky for a minimum of 20 minutes to acquire satellite data.

If you have additional questions or concerns, please respond to this email or feel free to call us.

We are available Monday-Thursday 8:00am-6pm CST and Friday 8:00am-5:00pmCST. Closed holidays.

Garmin Product Support (800)800-1020

>> Original Message …

>> >> >> From:

>> >> >> To:

Did not change anything. Garmin Express can’t find the Edge 1000 nor can the computer.

From: []

>> >> >> Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2015 11:31 AM

>> >> >> To:

I’m learning. If I start a ride and none of my sensors are connected then I know that my Edge has been updated by Garmin. I have to start playing around, eventually stopping the ride to re-connect the sensors. I have a dozen hour long rides that recorded 7 minutes of riding and jumps on my bike for miles until I finally got tired of trying to reconnect the sensors. I give up and work on them when I get home.

Update 1

I had not used my Edge 1000 for over a month. It was connected to my computer with the same USB cable I had used for the past year. One day I looked at it and realized it had connected again. I opened Garmin Express and voila it was there!

So, with no input on my part it is now working again.

Update 2

I tweeted about these issues before I wrote this article. I received the following from Garmin


Replying to @RecreationLaw

Hi Jim, I’d be happy to review your situation. Please send us a DM with the details as well as the email address you used when contacting support. -MR

  1. Jim, Thank you for the information and your patience with us over the extended Holiday weekend. Just to clarify, the Product Support associate was offering a possible cause for the issue you described. You claimed that a software update resolved your issue. However, the most recent update for the Edge 1000 was released in mid-March. I’ve looked over the software change history for the Edge 1000, but I see nothing mentioning any fix to connectivity issues. The updates included in 14.70, released mid-March as I mentioned, were: •Added Connect IQ 2.4.2 support. •Fixed an issue that could cause the device to crash when syncing segments. •Fixed an issue with the backlight not turning on consistently. •Fixed an issue with the user’s FTP resetting after changing the power zone configuration. I can understand your frustration and that you’re dissatisfied. Our associates have been assisting you as best they can with the information they have. Your device was believed to be up-to-date because you had been in contact with us multiple times since the software released in March, you were having issues with connectivity, and we currently have no open tickets that I can find regarding that type of issue on the Edge 1000. The suggestion that the data pins might have been damaged, dirty, or corroded was not an attempt at passing the buck, but rather a way for us to determine the cause of the issue you were experiencing. It sounds like updating the device resolved the issue for you, though looking at the change log, I don’t see how/why that would have worked or why an update would have presented itself if you’d already updated the product since the last release in March. Nevertheless, I’m glad to hear that things are running smoothly again. Thank you, -XXXX

    Sep 4

  2. The device was plugged in to a USB port since bringing it back from OR so nothing changed for a couple of weeks. I’ll correct my statements based on this, but honestly, based on my history with Garmin, I don’t buy it. 

    So, what is up? Could it be fate (not love just something out of my control.) or are map updates enough to mess with my Edge 1000. Or am I off my rocker and just wrong about everything?

    The reason why I’m guessing that even a map update, which seems to occur daily, can affect the rest of the Edge 1000 is because my sensors go offline, all of them more times a year than Garmin says they update the Edge 1000

    I don’t know. I and felt obligated to provide Garmin’s side of the story. However, part of me does not buy it.

    I’ll be at Interibke next week, I’ll see if any tech’s there have an opinion.

    What do you think? Leave a comment.

    Copyright 2018 Recreation Law (720) 334 8529

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    By Recreation Law    James H. Moss

    #AdventureTourism, #AdventureTravelLaw, #AdventureTravelLawyer, #AttorneyatLaw, #Backpacking, #BicyclingLaw, #Camps, #ChallengeCourse, #ChallengeCourseLaw, #ChallengeCourseLawyer, #CyclingLaw, #FitnessLaw, #FitnessLawyer, #Hiking, #HumanPowered, #HumanPoweredRecreation, #IceClimbing, #JamesHMoss, #JimMoss, #Law, #Mountaineering, #Negligence, #OutdoorLaw, #OutdoorRecreationLaw, #OutsideLaw, #OutsideLawyer, #RecLaw, #Rec-Law, #RecLawBlog, #Rec-LawBlog, #RecLawyer, #RecreationalLawyer, #RecreationLaw, #RecreationLawBlog, #RecreationLawcom, #Recreation-Lawcom,, #RiskManagement, #RockClimbing, #RockClimbingLawyer, #RopesCourse, #RopesCourseLawyer, #SkiAreas, #Skiing, #SkiLaw, #Snowboarding, #SummerCamp, #Tourism, #TravelLaw, #YouthCamps, #ZipLineLawyer,

I took my Garmin Vivosport off. In fact, I’m done with it.

Yes, the Garmin Vivosport can still record information, and if you recharge on a computer, you can sync the information. However, that is not what a fitness tracker is made for.

As it sits back on my desk, my Vivosport is a brick. A $200 brick actually a $169.99 brick if you go to the Garmin Vivosport website. I rounded up……

I flew to a different time zone. I landed and missed my first meetings because I did not realize my Vivosport did not automatically update. I did make happy hour!

I spent 20 minutes getting the date changed. I have four watches at home; it would have taken 20 seconds to change the date on them. I normally change the time when the plan leaves the runway. I’m ready when I walk down the gangway to be where I need to be when I need to be. I got use to my fitness trackers updating the time.

Upon arriving home, I quickly changed the Vivosport back to the right date.

I then synched my Vivosport, and it fixed the date automatically, there went 35 minutes of frustration, but then I did not pay to have a watch only be correct when it is hooked to a machine.

I took it off. It is plugged into my desk, still with the wrong date on it; it did not update for daylight saving’s time. If I sync it, it probably will. However, there is no reason to sync it.

The Garmin Vivosport is not my first fitness tracker. I had a Fitbit for 20 months. However, it literally fell off my wrist. The band where it connected to the Fitbit just disintegrated. Fitbit still works, but there was nothing I could do to put it back on my arm. Hence, the reason why I purchased the Garmin Vivosport. Never had a Garmin product fall apart, so it had to be better.

Fitbit for $100 for 20 months. Garmin Vivosport for four months for $200. Not thinking I made the right move.

Synching a fitness tracker is like watching a friend’s vacation photos, not videos, photos! At best, it is a history that I no longer recognize or know about. I know I’ve been there done that it’s just too late; it no longer has interest 2-4 days later.

What it is not doing, what I paid the money for it to do, is tell me in real time what I am doing, or not doing. Yes, it still comes on and says to move, but how much? What I have I done today, how long have I been sitting, how much more do I need to do? Is today a good day or a bad day, do I need to change some things around to catch up? My working Vivosport answered a lot of questions that I enjoyed and wanted to know. Now, it answers nothing. It provides no information without the manual and smaller fingers to help you learn how to find it.

I’m spoiled. I like a screen that I got to know that said to get off your butt and do something. It also told me how much of that something I needed to do.

I’m going to start working to send it back. It might be a hurdle, but between persistence and my law degree, I’ll get my money back. When I do, I’ll tell you how I got it done so you can get your money back also.

Unless you like your paperweight.

Update on my Garmin 1000

Keeping it plugged into a computer all the time, catching the occasional update also does not work. It just doesn’t seem to like it. When I check to see if it is charged and up to date, Garmin Express can’t find it, and the Edge 1000 needs to be turned off, reset or restarted.

So now it sits on my desk, with me hoping to remember to plug it in before in enough time to top off the charge and catch any updates.

Both situations seem to need software fixes. The Velosport I can understand dealing with Verizon, I don’t like Verizon either half the time. The Edge, I don’t understand why they can’t fix that issue. I know Garmin knows about it.

What do you think? Leave a comment.

Copyright 2018 Recreation Law (720) 334 8529

If you like this let your friends know or post it on FB, Twitter or LinkedIn


If you are interested in having me write your release, fill out this Information Form and Contract and send it to me.

Author: Outdoor Recreation Insurance, Risk Management and Law

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Facebook Page: Outdoor Recreation & Adventure Travel Law


Google+: +Recreation

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By Recreation Law    James H. Moss

#AdventureTourism, #AdventureTravelLaw, #AdventureTravelLawyer, #AttorneyatLaw, #Backpacking, #BicyclingLaw, #Camps, #ChallengeCourse, #ChallengeCourseLaw, #ChallengeCourseLawyer, #CyclingLaw, #FitnessLaw, #FitnessLawyer, #Hiking, #HumanPowered, #HumanPoweredRecreation, #IceClimbing, #JamesHMoss, #JimMoss, #Law, #Mountaineering, #Negligence, #OutdoorLaw, #OutdoorRecreationLaw, #OutsideLaw, #OutsideLawyer, #RecLaw, #Rec-Law, #RecLawBlog, #Rec-LawBlog, #RecLawyer, #RecreationalLawyer, #RecreationLaw, #RecreationLawBlog, #RecreationLawcom, #Recreation-Lawcom,, #RiskManagement, #RockClimbing, #RockClimbingLawyer, #RopesCourse, #RopesCourseLawyer, #SkiAreas, #Skiing, #SkiLaw, #Snowboarding, #SummerCamp, #Tourism, #TravelLaw, #YouthCamps, #ZipLineLawyer,

I love Garmin Products; I really can get annoyed at Garmin.

January 20, 2018

I went for a bike ride today. I knew immediately that since my last ride @Garmin had updated my Garmin Edge 1000. Garmin of course would never tell you this. Heaven forbid Garmin could communicate anything.

No, I learned when nothing was synched. No heart rate, no cadence, no speed, I just had one big blank screen.

I really knew it had been updated when I stopped the tracking, went into sensors and tried to have the sensors’ sync with my Edge 1000. Well wouldn’t you know it the update worked so well it froze my Edge 1000. In the past, I’ve thought about carrying instructions with me on how to unfreeze my Edge 1000 because it happens so often, but I don’t. So, I finished my ride looking at a blank screen.

So, I had a great bicycle ride. Not sure how long I went, where I went, what my heart rate was, what my cadence was, if my heart rate changed with my cadence or hills, all those things, you spend $800 to know.

The last time this happened this bad was in June of 2017. The updates basically froze my Edge 1000 for a couple of weeks. Garmin never said anything, never admitted there was a problem, just kept putting out updates and screwing things up. I was able to confirm that Garmin knew about it later talking to a tech rep.

I write this looking at my Garmin Vivosport. It is sitting here on my desk, not on my wrist because it is dead. Not quite 60 days old and some update to either the Vivosport, my android phone or Verizon killed it. 87 minutes on the phone last night with a very nice Garmin tech, who eventually gave up, after waiting for a call back for over an hour.

Last night, was not my first night talking to #GarminSupport about my #Vivosport. Out of the box, it would not work. That was three hours total waiting and then talking to tech support just to get it to work the first time.

So less than sixty days old and I’ve got close to FIVE HOURS with Garmin Tech support for a $200.00 Garmin product.

So, two Garmin products on my desk, over a Thousand Dollars retail and neither of them are doing anything like Garmin advertised nor what I paid for. Bricks are a lot cheaper if I need a paperweight, and I doubt I’ll have a desire to throw the brick out the window.

I started counting how many Garmin Products I own now or have purchased for family members, and how many I have owned.

Currently, I own.

Edge 1000


Vivo something for girlfriend

Garmin Car Navigation (dad)

Delta Sport XC (Dog collars (2))

Golf device (nephew)

Garmin Edge 350

This Edge 1000 is my 5th Garmin cycling computer.

And honestly, I can’t remember what else I’ve owned. But that is a lot of Garmin products, too many to put up with this crap.

What do I want?

I want Garmin to tell me when they are updating my devices. That way, I know I can’t just grab them and go. I know I’ll have to wait for the update and grab my Garmin Sheets and spend an hour getting ready to go.

My Garmin sheets are a spreadsheet of what I want on m Edge 1000 for my various bikes: 2 road bikes and two mountain bikes. There is a lot of information to put back in after an update. Garmin says their updates don’t affect my information, but that is a load of crap. My Garmin sheets are four years old and get used at least once or twice a year. I use them so much I have a name for them!

You would think I would ask that the updates don’t turn my Edge 1000 into a just out of the box nightmare. However, I don’t think that will ever happen. They tell you that so much they must believe it. Sometimes you have to be realistic on what you hope for. I have a better chance of winning Powerball than Garmin updating a product and not screwing it up.

I want the updates to work. Not fry my Edge 1000 or make my Vivosport a paperweight. I never know why the updates are needed. I just don’t need them turning my devices in projects or paperweights.

I want a survey at the end of my two-hour phone calls with tech support to be something other than platitudes. Have you ever taken that survey? All it does is make you tell Garmin how great they are. Last night I hung up after the fifth question. The answers Garmin was going to get would only reinforce the marketing department egos, so they could do the same the higher ups. It was not going to provide relevant information about how bad the tech support really is. People on the phone are great, last night the tech person was extremely apologetic he could not get my device to work. But my vivosport still does not work.

I want my Garmin Products to work!

I wrote this article January 20, 2018. I contacted Garmin, I’ve tweeted Garmin and was told I never contacted Garmin. Then I was asked to supply my email address which I did.

January 26, 2018

So at the @OutdoorRetailer Tradeshow I mentioned this article. I also shared it with an employee of Garmin. Yesterday I received an email and a tweet from Garmin. The tweet clarified that my statement I contacted Garmin said Saturday and it was actually Friday when I was on the phone with them. That office I was on the phone with was closed Saturday so they were confused. My fault!

@Garmin did not have a booth at the Outdoor Retailer Tradeshow. Bad move. I always learn a lot at the tradeshows about my products and now that I know there is tons more to learn, I’ll probably show up with products in hand and questions to ask.

February 6, 2018

The email was followed up by a pretty high level person in the Garmin program who went through my issues. I learned a lot. All of which is not in any Garmin manual or on the Garmin website.

  1. Instead of charging my Edge 1000 on a charger, I should charge it on my computer. That way updates won’t be a problem in the future if I check on Garmin Connect right before I disconnect the Garmin. In the Upper Right Corner there is a little watch. If there is a blue dot, an update is available. If you have the app Garmin Express, a blue dot on your product in Garmin Express also means you have updates.

    1. There are a crap load of updates.
  2. My Vivosport is not really a brick. It can still record activity and will store it for a long time, I just can’t see it on my phone or Garmin Connect. Garmin Connect on my phone has a software issue with Verizon (my carrier) and the Vivosport. I’m not on a list to be notified when that changes. (I was told previously I was on a list…..)

    1. So now when I charge my VivoSport I charge it connected to my computer. I use Garmin Express and it updates the VivoSport and downloads the information.
  3. The people I’ve been on the phone with have always been extremely polite and worked hard to solve my problems. The person(s) tweeting can get testy.  🙂  But I suspect I can push them a little harder on twitter.

Are the problems solved? No. Do I feel better. Yes.  Do I have workarounds to my issues. I think but not all.

I still don’t know what I’m doing with my Vivosport during the day. Every 3 or 4 days when I charge it I can see what I did, but that is worthless. I could carry my Edge 1000 or Edge 350 and accomplish a lot more.  The purpose of a VivoSport is to learn throughout your day how and why and then change.  3-4 days later doesn’t help. So technically my VivoSport works, but actually, it is still a brick. I wear it on my arm because I don’t really have any paper to hold down.

Are the engineers who seem to run Garmin going to communicate more or better? I doubt it. If you are not an engineer or have hours to spend just clicking things you’ll never learn enough on how your Garmin products, Garmin Express or Garmin Connect work.

Thanks to the un-named employees who probably leaked my article upline. Thanks to the people who called and spent hours on the phone with my trying to help.

But the problems still exist. Garmin communicates like we are all engineers and only when pressed. I’m not an engineer. I also don’t have time to contact Garmin and spend almost 10 hours on the phone for a $200 product.  I have it on again and someday I hope to see what it says.

Still love my Garmin Products. But Garmin, as a company selling to consumers you suck…..still.

What do you think? Leave a comment.

To Comment Click on the Heading and go to the bottom of the page.

Copyright 2018 Recreation Law (720) 334 8529

If you like this let your friends know or post it on FB, Twitter or LinkedIn


If you are interested in having me write your release, fill out this Information Form and Contract and send it to me.

Author: Outdoor Recreation Insurance, Risk Management and Law

To Purchase Go Here:

Facebook Page: Outdoor Recreation & Adventure Travel Law


Google+: +Recreation

Twitter: RecreationLaw

Facebook: Rec.Law.Now

Facebook Page: Outdoor Recreation & Adventure Travel Law


Mobile Site:

By Recreation Law    James H. Moss

#AdventureTourism, #AdventureTravelLaw, #AdventureTravelLawyer, #AttorneyatLaw, #Backpacking, #BicyclingLaw, #Camps, #ChallengeCourse, #ChallengeCourseLaw, #ChallengeCourseLawyer, #CyclingLaw, #FitnessLaw, #FitnessLawyer, #Hiking, #HumanPowered, #HumanPoweredRecreation, #IceClimbing, #JamesHMoss, #JimMoss, #Law, #Mountaineering, #Negligence, #OutdoorLaw, #OutdoorRecreationLaw, #OutsideLaw, #OutsideLawyer, #RecLaw, #Rec-Law, #RecLawBlog, #Rec-LawBlog, #RecLawyer, #RecreationalLawyer, #RecreationLaw, #RecreationLawBlog, #RecreationLawcom, #Recreation-Lawcom,, #RiskManagement, #RockClimbing, #RockClimbingLawyer, #RopesCourse, #RopesCourseLawyer, #SkiAreas, #Skiing, #SkiLaw, #Snowboarding, #SummerCamp, #Tourism, #TravelLaw, #YouthCamps, #ZipLineLawyer, #Garmin, @Garmin, #Vivosport, #GarminSupport, #GarminTechSupport, Garmin Support, Garmin Tech Support, Garmin Edge, Garmin Edge 1000, #GarminEdge, #GarminEdge1000,

Win a #SuuntoAmbitions and other Great Prizes just for having fun

#SuuntoAmbitions contest drives outdoor inspiration through everyday adventure photosAmbit2_S_Perspective_View_Lime

The social media sweepstakes awards Suunto Ambit2 S watches to participants who exhibit ambition

Ogden, UT – June 4, 2013—Suunto USA is announcing its #SuuntoAmbitions contest to encourage adventurers of all levels to inspire each other through various outdoor ambitions.

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Alongside inspiring posts from Suunto athletes like Kim Havell, Brody Leven and Christina Lusti, close to 1,000 submissions have been already tallied just weeks into the contest, with many more expected over the remaining weeks until the contest official ends on June 23, 2013. Suunto is awarding once-per-week winners with a new Suunto Ambit2 S—the lightweight heart rate and GPS unit that features advanced, seamless tracking technology for running, biking, swimming and other sports.

At the contest’s close, a community vote will decide on a grand-prize winner from 10 of the most ambitious entrants. That winner will receive more than $2,500 in gear from Suunto, Salomon, Atomic and Arc’teryx.

To enter, simply upload a photo to Facebook, Twitter or Instagram using the #SuuntoAmbitions hashtag of yourself or someone else doing something ambitious. Include a caption describing your goals and how you’re pushing boundaries and conquering new territories. (You can view the current gallery, here.)

For more information about the contest and to enter now, visit the #SuuntoAmbitions official contest page. Facebook

Brought to you by the Beautiful Woman of Outside Media……and Shane….